0:08 I was a Hollywood cameraman for 25 years. That's what I did. And I walked out, and I was getting a glass of water. We looked out over the ridge, and there was this, something kind of flew out of the sky and kind of came out from above the ridge. Any noise? None. Dead silent. The very next thing I remember is being down on the ground on my face and pushing myself up like this. At the same time, I looked around, and all the other kids, the brothers, stepbrothers, and the cousins were all, like, getting up off the ground. And my dad asks me, like, where have you been? So it turns out that my stepmother, when she was young, she was participating in the Masonic Order of Job's Daughters. The aunt was a hairdresser in that little town, and she, in her shop, she would actually claim to be able to talk to the dead, and she would have communications with spirits, and things in her shop would move around by themselves and reorient themselves while she was there working.
1:04 That family had a really strong connection. They had a strong connection to spiritualism. But they mentioned the town. They mentioned that, you know, when things happen in this town, you know, bad things happen to people when they talk about it, too, when they're public about talking about what happens to them. Huh. Have you ever talked about it to these kids that were with you? You know, years later, we did mention it, but they didn't really want to talk about it. But there was a lot of dark, you know, stuff that was going on in that area. But then the strange thing happened is that the fiction started to sort of, like, manifest itself as if it was real. Huh. And that's what was really strange, and that's what actually led me, further and further down the rabbit hole. What is this that is happening right now, and where is it coming from? Well, it's not outer space. No. It's around here. Unless you're actually biblically grounded, you will absolutely end up on the enemy's side. Absolutely. A hundred percent. If you leave the truth, you ignore the truth, and you go down another way to find a third way or a second way or whatever you want to say, it will always lead you to the enemy.
2:01 And as it got higher and higher, it ramped up into speed and just went... It shot like that. What? This is the first story I have heard of that happening. Andrew, thank you so much for coming out here. You have an amazing testimony. And I think I want to hear more about it, and I know other people do too. You coming from Hollywood, but you have a little bit of some mystical information to tell us about being out there, some spiritualism that happened as well. And I'd like to hear more about that. I was a Hollywood cameraman for 25 years. That's what I did. And I used to say that I had the best seat in the house because I sat behind a camera and I had my camera IP sign. I would film everything, but I really do have the best seat in the house now. It's so much better than the job I had before. And that's doing ministry. I have a ministry called Sanctuary Door Ministry.
2:51 You can find it, www.sanctuarydoorministry.com. And there you can find out what I'm doing. You can find sermons. You can find PDFs, Bible studies that I've produced. And you can also contact me or support me that way. So I have a way to reach me there. I also have on social media, I have an X account, which I haven't used for a very long time, which I probably have to start using now again soon. I'm from Hollywood. It's just at Andrew Bukischke, you know, on X, Andrew Bukischke. So, I mean, I grew up as a child in the 80s. I was born in the 70s, but it was really like late 70s, early 80s television, you know, that I used to watch. And, you know, I think a lot of the reason why I got into Hollywood was because of the stuff I watched on television, the music I was listening to, music videos. It was watching music, you know, music being sunk with images or vice versa. And it was just that. It was fascinating. It was fascinating to me and it captured my interest. And so that was always in my imagination to be, you know, to work with music and to work with images. And that's kind of probably one of the greatest inspirations I had to go to Hollywood.
3:53 It was to create the stuff that I grew up watching. So did you watch like, was it like music videos or was it? Music videos, Miami Vice, Miami Vice specifically. Because Miami Vice seemed to blend music videos and, you know, theatrical production. You know, it was very, I don't know, it was great. It was exciting television for the 80s. I mean, it was groundbreaking, right? So that was probably the biggest inspiration I had for getting into the film business. But alongside of that, you know, I had a fascination sort of with science fiction. You know, I grew up as an Adventist. I grew up as a Christian. And science fiction was not something that you're supposed to read or that, you know, you should. So I argued, I kind of bargained with my parents that if I found something that, had science fact in it, you know, could I read that?
4:45 Like if there was actual factual stuff in it. So there was a magazine called Analog Science Fiction Science Fact. Because it had the subtitle science fact, I convinced my parents to get a subscription. I could get a subscription as a kid. So I was reading science fiction when I was pretty young. And I just really, it just, I gravitated to it, you know, because it was the imaginary worlds that it created were just fascinating to me. And even though I was raised in the faith, and understood there's creation, there's the Garden of Eden, there was the fall, all of this stuff was in my background, being raised as an Adventist. I was just totally seduced by the imagination of these other worlds. I just thought it was very interesting. So I remember watching, there was a show called, do you remember the show In Search Of? I know that you're a little younger than me. A little bit.
5:34 A little bit. But I mean, you probably, Leonard Nimoy used to host it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Familiar with that? I've heard of it. Yeah, it was kind of a cult. It was a really weird show. But, I mean, it's precursor to, you know, to a lot of the shows you have, like, on History Channel now, or some of those other channels, where they go into, like, you know, phenomena, ghost houses, and haunted houses, and paranormal experiences. And I just remember, you know, that was a show I used to watch as well. And it was in syndication at the time that I was watching, so, like, you could sometimes watch it, like, all the time. There were episodes that were, like, you know, about demons, about haunted houses, about witchcraft. And then there were ones about aliens. And that's the one that, because I didn't, I knew that, you know, that there was a devil. I believed that as a kid. I knew that there were demons. I knew there were fallen angels. I went in, nothing to do with that. Sure. Like, nothing. Nope. Don't give me any of that stuff. I don't want that stuff.
6:25 But it was the aliens that were interesting, because it was science fiction. It's like, well, that's just reality. You know, that's just a reality we don't know. It's above us. It's beyond us. It's, you know, advanced. It's just, you know, I was just a kid. Yeah, yeah. That's good. So, I remember watching some of those episodes, episodes of In Search Of. And there was one night that I finished watching it, and it went to a commercial break or something. And I went out to the kitchen. And out of the kitchen, we had this, over the sink, we had this window that looked outside. And it was dark already. It was night. And I walked out, and I was getting a glass of water. And I just happened to just look up into the sky at that time. And I looked up at the sky, and there was this little circular thing going through the sky. Because we lived near, in Bering Springs, there's an airport there. Andrews University has an airport. So, I was. I was growing up watching, you know, the planes. And there's a blue and there's a red light on the plane.
7:15 There's, you know, you know what Cessna's look like at night. And this was not like that at all. And this was kind of slow going. It had these rotating lights. It was like out of a movie. It was, like, ridiculous. But I was just, like, I was stunned in the silence. I couldn't believe that I was just watching something go across the sky, the kind of stuff that I was just watching on the television. And that was the first time that I ever saw something. And, you know, it kind of, you know. It left me kind of paralyzed for a bit. You know, kind of in shock that I'd seen that. But I just, you know. I don't know if I talked to too many people about it. But, you know, childhood goes away. Years go by. You know, you kind of forget those things until something else happens. So, it was the first time you saw something. That's the first time I saw something. But, you know, like I said, I was reading those stories. I used to go out at night. And, you know, 2 or 3 o'clock in the morning, I'd wake up in the middle of the night.
8:09 And I would go outside. And this is kind of a rural area in Bering Springs. And I would go out and I would sit on the deck. And I would just look up at the stars in the sky. And it would be just, you know. There's no light pollution where I was. So, I would just like see just like, you know. It was just like see forever. It seemed like the Milky Way was really clear. And I was into astronomy too. So, I knew my constellations. I knew where things were. And I would just go up there and imagine what it was like beyond what I could see. That there was like these civilizations out there. Or that there was something just beyond what we could see. That was maybe looking at me. And I wasn't always thinking about, you know, God or the angels or heaven. But I was just thinking, I know that life was out there. Because, I mean, as an Adventist, we know that there's other worlds, right? And Job chapter 1 talks about, you know, the counsel of the worlds.
8:57 You know, and Hebrews chapter 1 talks about he made the world. So, there was this knowledge of knowing else in the writings, you know, that we have. Can I add to that too? Yeah. Jesus talks about the sheep. And the sheep. There was one sheep that left. Remember this? At the very end of that parable, he says something very peculiar. He says, he says, talks about how Jesus had left, or he had left the 99 to go save the one that needed no, no salvation. Needed no, that had, had righteousness. What human actually needs no savior? How is that even possible? So, I don't think these sheep are actually talking about humans. I think he's talking about. Yeah. Ellen White talks about it. Being different worlds. He came to this world because this is the one that fell out of all the other worlds.
9:48 So, I had this, I had that knowledge. I had some, I didn't, a theoretical understanding of it, right? So, I would just think, you know, there's these huge ships just out there, just beyond our reach that are just there waiting for us or watching us or. It was just, it was just my imagination as a kid, but I was constantly thinking about that. But parallel to that as well. If there was any. If there was any recurring dream I would ever have in my, in my childhood or like a nightmare, because sometimes, you know, kids have those things. I did have, it was always alien invasion. Huh. It was always alien invasion. The movie Signs. And I'll, some of those people out there, you know, I don't recommend any of these movies, but the movie Signs, M. Night Shyamalan, he, he, that movie actually really captured my anxiety.
10:37 And that, that, that dream I used to have, that, that, that movie was, was. Was, that to me felt like my nightmare. Hmm. Like I grew up with, it was really strange to see that. So, that just was just in my back, you know, I, every once in a while, I would just have that nightmare that aliens were going to invade. Was it similar or was it the same? Very, very similar, very, very similar ideas, like, you know, that there was things that appearing in the sky and that it was going to appear very quickly on the ground. And then everybody, everybody was found, everybody was seen, no one can hide. So, so this dream would repeat. And I, and I, and it would be the same pretty much. Yeah. Every time. It's the same concept, the same idea. So, I was definitely in my imagination as a child. And, you know, I, I, you know, this interest in science fiction and, and aliens continued when I was older.
11:29 I mean, I wasn't really obsessed about it for, for, forever. It was kind of, I was more interested at some point in, in foreign movies and filmmaking and art movies. Because I became a, you know, a cameraman in Hollywood. Yeah. And I was really interested in making art movies, you know, art house stuff, you know, festival movies. Not Hollywood blockbuster movies. I was really interested in the art films. So, that was really where my head was. But I, I always had that in my background. And the X-Files was a big show. Did you probably? Yeah. Of course. I wouldn't do the X-Files. I didn't get into it right away. But eventually when, because I mean, I was not so much into that as, once I got older. But eventually, you know, when that, the show was about halfway through, I started to pick it up and start watching all the old episodes. And then started watching all the new ones. And, and I was captivated again by that same idea of the aliens that are just out beyond our reach that are there watching us. And that are, you know, they're interacting with us and what's going on.
12:21 So, I, I, in my Hollywood time, I got a chance to actually work with Chris Carter, who is the creator of the X-Files. I ended up working for the cameraman that shot the last four years of the X-Files in Los Angeles. After they did the movie, they did the first movie. And then they did the last four seasons in Los Angeles. They've done further seasons in Vancouver after that. But I worked with that, that crew, that cameraman and that crew. And so, because of that, they did a movie with Chris Carter later on that he directed, which never got released, called Fence Walker. And I had a chance to, you know, hang out with Chris, you know, on that set a few times, you know, when we were just waiting for a lighting setup. And I got a chance to say, hey, mind if I tell you my UFO story? And this is not the one where I go out to the sink and see a little thing going across the sky.
13:08 Yeah. It's a much more interactive experience with that phenomena. Tell me about it. So it was in the 80s. I think it was 1986. I'm pretty sure it was 86. It was 86 and we were up in northern Michigan. I grew up in Berrien Springs, like I said. But in Hale, Michigan, about five hours or so north and a little bit to the east, there is my father remarried. My parents are divorced. My father remarried. And his wife, my stepmother. Grew up in that area. And we were there visiting her parents and her brother who's got a house, you know, just down the street from the parents. And we're staying there. It's over the holidays. I think it's like between Christmas and New Year's. It's like that little week between the two.
13:55 And we were, the kids, there's seven of us. There's my brother and there's two older stepbrothers. And then there's three cousins. So there's seven kids ranging from, I don't know, like, say. You know, 10, 9, 10 years old up to like 18, 19 years old. It's a group of seven. And we were in the uncle's house. And we were just kind of hanging out there. And the sun was going down and it was getting time for dinner. And my father calls from grandma's house and say, hey, guys, come on over. Dinner's ready. I think this was Saturday night. It was Saturday night. The sun had just gone down. And so we all got our snowsuits on, you know. We got to put our snowsuits on it. We're literally going to walk. Like, it's like half a football field. I mean, it's not that far. The houses are very close to each other.
14:42 So we just kind of leave the house and we start walking across the front of the lawn to the other front lawn and then actually go into the house. And as we were crossing between the two houses, about between the two to the left-hand side, I don't remember which direction, cardinal directions these houses were laid out. But towards the left as we're walking from one house to the other, we looked out over the ridge and there was this, something kind of flew out of the sky and kind of came out from above the ridge. And it came toward us. And it was so strange because the, just the way that it happened, just, it seems like altered perception. Like something wasn't quite right. It was very... Any noise? None. It was dead silent. It came, I think that's kind of what it is. You see something, but yet there's no noise. It kind of comes at us and it stays, and eventually it's completely overhead. Totally overhead. Oh, wow. And we all kind of look up at it like this. And the last thing I remember is a noise. Is a numbness starting in the top of my head.
15:38 And then it just kind of like felt like it just poured through my whole body. Like something started to pour into my head and just went all the way down to my toes. And I just, I dropped out unconscious. The very next thing I remember is, is being down on the ground on my face and pushing myself up like this. At the same time I looked around and all the other kids, the brothers, stepbrothers, and the cousins were all like getting up off the ground at the same time. Like coming to at the same time. And then looking up and the thing, it just, as we kind of look up, it starts to leave and continue in the direction it was coming originally. And just continue going the same, same way. And eventually it just kind of went, and then it went really fast and was gone. I, it's hard to remember exactly what it looked like, but it was, it wasn't like completely, it was like had some sorts of all kinds of shapes or something. It looked, it looked like a very industrial kind of looking too.
16:30 It was kind of squarish more. Huh. But it had lots of, lots of lights on the bottom, all kinds of weird. It was, I don't have a very clear picture. I don't have a clear recollection, but I just remember looking up at something I couldn't quite identify or make out what it was, but just see some patterns or shapes or, and then some lots of lights on it. And it was, you know, I mean, this is the kind of things you, you see in movies. It's things that you hear people say, and you think, well, that person, you know, had an episode, you know, they had did some drugs or, you know, they hallucinated or they're mentally ill or, you know, they're schizophrenic. No, not at all. And you just sort of like, but then when it happens to you, it's like, well, that really happened. That's real. Yeah. So this, that really struck me. So the next thing that happened was, is we're walking into the house. Wait, before you go into that, let me ask you some questions about it.
17:17 Oh yeah. Do you remember anything, anything, how, how much time you had lost or? Oh yeah. Well, yeah. That's after we got into the house. Okay. So, so yeah. So as we were going into the house, one of the cousins said that lived there that actually lived on that, you know, in the uncle's house that lived there. Yeah. He said, whatever you do, don't tell anybody about what happened. And we're like, and we're like, why? He says, well, when people talk about those kinds of things in this area, bad things happen to them. Oh. This is like out of the movies. It's like an X-Files episode. I think this is, I mean, this is before the X-Files, right? You know, but how old are you again? I was, I was, I was about 13, I think 13, 13, 14, 13 years old. Yeah. No, about 12, 13, somewhere in there.
18:06 So he kind of knew that other things had happened in the area. I think I was 12 turning 13 that year. He knew other things were happening in the area? Yeah. Well, I could, I could jump around and tell you years later. Tell me, tell me. Yeah. Let's continue with your story. Yeah. Let's, let's stay simple, somewhat linear. So we go into the house after that, you know, it's like, don't say anything. And my dad asks me like, where have you been? I'm like, what do you mean? We just got on, we just, you know, walked across the, he said that, where'd you been? It's been like 45 minutes. Ah, 45 minutes again. It's literally, it's less, it's, it's like a two minute walk, less than a two minute walk, especially for kids walking across one lawn to the other. We, it was 45 minutes. So we, we experienced the missing time. Wow.
18:52 The 45 minutes, it was very strange. I have no memory of anything that happened. So what I told, I, I was working on this movie years later in Hollywood with Chris Carter. And I'm like, hey, I gotta tell you my story. Heh. And he's like, sure. So I, I go through, I tell him the story that I told you with all that stuff. And, and I got the goosebumps as I was telling him the story. And he says, I got, he says, I got goosebumps too. I was like, I got, I gave Chris Carter goosebumps. He, he said, you know, your story is extremely unique. He's extremely unique. He says many, cause he said, you know, people have sent, you know, Chris Carter. I mean, he gets. Yeah. Tons of stories from people about their encounters and things. He said one of the ways that he was inspired to write the scripts. Um, and to, to do the creative input for that show for X-Files was to listen to people's stories.
19:42 He'd say, record them, record them on cassette or something. And he would play them and listen to them as he would go to sleep at night. Huh. People's encounters and stories and abduction stories and everything. He would listen to those. So he's heard many stories. He's a whole catalog of them. But when he said he heard that one, he says, that's a really, he says, that's a very, very small group of people that experience what you, he said. One, that you experienced it with a group, not just one person or two people, but a whole group of people. Yeah. And that you remembered it later too. He said, that's really, it's like, that's really rare. But then he said another thing to me. He says, you know, it seems to be whenever, if you have an encounter like that, it seems like you're in the program somehow. Once you're in the program, your whole life you're in the program. Hmm. And he referred to it as the program thinking like, well, this, you know, you watch the X-Files, you know, there's this whole.
20:33 Yeah. Story about, you know, the, the collaboration between the, you know, the different aliens and the, and the government and the, the, the sort of military industrial complex part of the, you know, that's adjacent to the actual government and who's running things, which I think actually mirrors a lot of reality to some degree. So, yeah, so that was, you know, and he did tell me, he says, if you ever want to remember what happened during that time, he says, I'd be happy to pay for a hypnotist. Regression. Yeah. A regression therapy. Everyone says that. I don't think so. I, you know, I was raised as an Adventist. I was raised with that knowledge and I wasn't converted by it just by knowing it. I had to come back later in my life to the faith. But I knew, I knew as a child, like you're taught, this is right, this is wrong. So I kind of understood, well, the state of the dead, you know, the dead don't know anything.
21:23 Ghosts are not really the dead people that have come back to talk to you. They're, they're falling. I knew that. I never lost that. I just thought aliens, well, that's different because that's science fiction. That's something that's not, you know, dead people. That's something life from other planets and I know there's life out there. So is this sort of like that, you know, I don't know how did, how, how that happens to somebody because it happened to me. I guess it was like you, you sort of entertain a suggestion and well, what if, what if, what if, what if the Bible is, is, is just so parabolic, you know, it's, it's, it's a parable. It's not quite literal, you know, that you can kind of like, well, maybe this is what it was talking about and that the Bible was speaking in a metaphoric language. And yet, yet this is really the reality. Like, you know, it makes you think, it makes you think, and it's the suggestions and the suggestions get planted and then they start to, to bore into your mind and they start to, you know, imperceptibly start to change and think, well, maybe this is not quite, this is what I thought it was.
22:22 And maybe it's really this. I think that's what happened to me is I started to swallow that, you know, as a kid watching movies and reading books and the suggestions. Questions that came through that and then it's not being so settled. This is after you had studied or he had read some books on this stuff and then you had this experience. It was very, very, well, yeah, so I was in, uh, so while I was in Hollywood, we were, I was working on a TV show, uh, this is much after 13, well after 13 years, no, this is in my thirties and stuff. And I, I was in Hollywood and we were shooting in, in a bookstore downtown LA somewhere. It was like a used bookstore. And there was a, um, there's a. The end caps, you know, the bookstore and we were just, you know, the cameras just sitting there, you know, they didn't really set dress it, you know, it was just, they, we just plopped their cameras into a location and I was just kind of looking at the bookstore on the shelf between takes and there was like this book there and it was about UFO abductions and encounters and I said, I just picked it up and started reading it.
23:18 And then I'm like, I started to remember what happened to me, but I was reading the story about this. And I was like, well, this is kind of, I don't know, this is a little crazy. It starts to get a little, I mean, I was not inside of, I don't have been outside of craft or doing anything like that. Or being abducted that I'd have no memory of that. I don't have any indications, anything like that happened other than that, that experience. And so I was just reading that and I was going, you know, I, it made me think about what happened to me and it kind of refreshed my, my thinking about like, you know, pondering what's, what's really going on. And do you think, I mean, this is hard questions. I don't think we have the answers to it completely, but you've read Roger Murnau, right? Yes. So he saw some of these during his time in the satanic church. He watched these people who had done their devotions to basically Lucifer be perfectly possessed and then speak out through channel these things.
24:20 And after they come back, they say, how long was I out? And they don't have any recollection of what's going on. I'm not saying you were possessed, but I, I, you know, I, I would never have, I would never have, like, I mean, everything that I got involved with was not like knowing what I was doing. It was sort of very like as a kid with science fiction as, you know, seeing things happening. I mean, at 13 years old, my, my brother was 10, you know, and I think, and the other cousin was around my brother's age. So it's like I said, this range, some of them were adults, but I mean, some of these were, you know, they were under 12 years old. It's like, I don't, you know, like, how does that happen to, to kids without, you know, Permission. Well, you know, it happened in, I know for sure. I've researched this. A little bit. The, there's an aerial school in South Africa and that you've probably read the stories about this one. If you haven't, you should.
25:06 It's very interesting because there was a group of kids in a school and they saw something and they said something came and all of a sudden we lost time. These kids are 40 and 50 years old now and they maintain the same story. And it turns out that one of the, that there was some nefarious things going on. I can't say yet because it's coming out in a book sometime, but I've been told that when you are, I'll say it this way, when you are a parent or when you are an overseer or something, you got to make sure that you're not into something else because it will affect what you're in charge of. Or you are opening the door for those. Yeah. Oh, absolutely. That, that's it. That's a fact for sure. And again, I'm not saying that your parents or anybody else saying you were involved in that, but that's what happened in this instance. Oh yeah. And tie that in with what happened in Hale, Michigan.
26:02 So I, I told you, you know, that a years later I found out more about that town and what was going on in that town. I told my parents, this is after I got baptized, like I was baptized, I came back to church in 2017 and got baptized. And I was, I was in, I was visiting my family back in Michigan and I was, I was with my father and my stepmother and we were talking and I reminded them of that night that we had the missing time. And I told him, and my dad kind of vaguely remembers, he doesn't really remember it very well. He's, you know, he's, he's, he's, he's 87 this year. He really doesn't completely, I mean, he kind of says, I remember calling you guys and you guys were really late. And so he does remember the incident. And my stepmother kind of vaguely, like I had to talk to them about it for a while and jog their memory, but then they kind of remembered vaguely, but they don't remember what we said too much about it.
26:55 They just thought it was, you know, what are you just, you're just, your kid's a mess. Yeah. You're messing around. Yeah. But then I found out what's going on in that, that, that, that family, that the, the, the aunt was a hairdresser in that little town and she, in her shop, she would talk to the dead. She would actually claim to be able to talk to the dead and, and she would, she would have communications with spirits and things in her shop would move around by themselves and reorient themselves while she was there working. Like, you know, things like, I don't know, a bottle of hairspray would go across the room and put itself on another. Yeah. On another shelf or something. So, and she was totally comfortable with this and communing with these spirits and talking and they would just rearrange her shop and do all kinds of. And this is the lady that you were coming from? This is the lady's house you were coming from or? This is, yeah, this is the lady's house that I was coming from now. That's so she was involved in that.
27:45 Okay. Interesting. Yeah. So, and here's another thing. So my stepmother remembers, cause my stepmother was not raised an Adventist. She was also divorced. She, she married an Adventist and they, they, that marriage ended. And so my parents got, you know, my father remarried her. Her, both her second marriage. So, but she was not an Adventist in the beginning. She was raised, you know, in that, in that area right there on that, that house in that, in that street. And she said that there was a time when she was young that her dad was kind of involved like in a secret society. I think it was like kind of dabbled with Freemasonry. He didn't stay in it or, or anything. He kind of got out of it. It was very low level. So it turns out that my stepmother, when she was young. She was, uh, she was participating in the Masonic order of Job's daughters, which is set up for, for young women from the ages of 10, sort of to 20.
28:38 And you have to somehow be connected Freemasonry in your family. So she remembers doing these strange rituals where she would put on a gown, there's a canned, I don't know. She vaguely remembers it, but they didn't, it didn't last for very long. I think it was only for a few years and then, you know, the, you know, cause her father was a, was involved in Masonry. And so they, they didn't do that forever. That was just for a small period of time. But. There was a Freemason thing going on there and there was, you know, spiritualism, you know, openly talking to, you know, the spirits with her, with her sister-in-law. So that, that family had a really strong connection to spiritualism and, but they mentioned the town. They mentioned that, you know, when things happen in this town, you know, bad things happen to people when they talk about it too, when they be, when they're public about talking about what happens to them. Huh. So it's strange that, you know, the kids, you know, that we were with that night, that happened, they couldn't explain it or said if they, but they just knew that when something like this happens, you don't talk about it.
29:32 Have you ever talked about it to the kids that were with you? Or we did mention it, but they didn't really want to talk about it, but there was a lot of dark, you know, stuff that was going on. So years later now I'm in Hollywood and I've had, you know, this, this history that I've, you know, that I experienced when I was like 12, 13 years old that I sort of like forgotten most of my life. I bring it up to my brother again, you know, I'm in my thirties. He's earlier. You know, it was mid thirties and I'm, and I'm talking and he's like, yeah, no, I thought I was the only one that remembers like, no, no, I remember that happened too. And he was, he was kind of relieved because he thought he was going a little crazy because he thought he was the only one that remembered. And I'm like, no, no, it happened. I remember I was there. So you know, years later, my memory was jogged by finding that book in that, in that place we were shooting that show on a show in, and I, I just started to think about it. I started to get back into my head and started, you know, make questions like, you know, how real is that stuff?
30:28 Because knowing as an Adventist, as a, as a Christian that, you know, the Bible is the standard for history, I mean, it's like, this is like, you know, you know, evolutionists can say the world was, is this old or that old, or you can say it's this or that ultimately it has to be checked by the record of the Bible. So I had not forgotten that, but yet I'm thinking maybe there's some room where these both exist in reality that it's, you know, either complimentary or not contradictory. That was just, you know, but I was not in the church at the time either. And I was living in Hollywood. So I was certainly not in the proper frame of mind to really be discerning or, or studying or reading my Bible at time. This is, it's really hard to talk about this because it's, it's my past that was like what basically kind of brought me back. It was going down this road that really got my attention.
31:22 When I was young in school, in sixth grade, I grew up in Bethlehem. I grew up in Berrien Springs, right at Ruth Murdoch Elementary School was the school I went to from kindergarten through, through ninth grade at the, at the academy. And I left and went, 16 years old, I left and went into the world, but I had a Christian education for the first part of my life, very solid. In sixth grade, they, they allowed a, an evangelist to come in and give us a Bible study, like a, a two week revelation seminar series when I was like in sixth grade. And I was so convicted. That what I was studying in Daniel and Revelation with all my classmates was not just real, but it was going to happen to me personally. Like I was going to be there in this situation that we're talking about in the future with the mark of the beast, with the plagues, all these things. I was so convicted. The Holy Spirit convicted me so much that I was, I was like stunned into shock. I was thinking like, this is going to happen. This is real.
32:21 And I never forgot that. And so years later, when I'm trying to. To express these ideas visually about trying to ponder it, where do we really come from and try to just make an interesting visual experiment out of it. I kind of blended some of that in Revelation, which is really strange. It's a really strange. But it was kind of like a way of, of getting my attention to remind me where I came from. But I was also flirting with the, you know, not realizing what I was really flirting with. And that's really what I'm kind of getting to is I didn't realize what the door was. I was really opening. What it was. What I was dealing with. I was doing it in a way where I thought it was just, you know, fantasy. It was just imaginary. It was just like, but something really happened to me. So what is it? You know, trying to make sense of that, you know, at the time, um, aliens, Prometheus came out that year, Ridley Scott did like a prequel to the aliens and I was into aliens too.
33:15 I didn't like horror so much. I don't like horror. I don't like gory stuff or in aliens. It's kind of like that, but I like the, the concept behind it was the engineers, like the first alien movie where they find that. You know, the, the space jockey and the big, it was like, who's that, where did that come from? And I know this is fiction. I know it's fiction, but it was just, it captivated my interest as a kid. I was like, that was like, that's so cool at that. What's that world like? What does it look like? So that movie kind of came on the scene at the same time I was thinking all these things and I started to feel like you, you know, the term zeitgeist, like I can sense there's, there's a zeitgeist moment here going on with this. And I could feel it. I've always been sort of like ahead of the curve and things that I've done like a little, like a few years ahead. Like. Yeah. To technology or, or things are going, I've always sort of been like on that cutting edge of stuff to be, I mean, this is how it's been. It's not anything I planned or anything in particular about me. It's just, I've always seemed to be in the situation.
34:05 So for me, I was like, this is the thing that's next. I knew that I could just tell that this topic and getting into this is, is what's in the future. I just had that, that, that kind of instinct when I was at that time in my life. And so I, I just dove, you know, head first into this, you know, you know, sort of conceptual thinking about all these things to answer these questions. And, and kind of answer from that point of view, again, as an art project, just as fiction. Yeah. But then the strange thing happened is that the fiction started to sort of like manifest itself as if it was real. Huh. And that's what was really strange. And that's what actually led me further and further down the rabbit hole, you know? And so again, when I look back at it, I think, well, yeah, no, I was kind of, in a sense, almost groomed like this from childhood, watching this kind of stuff on television, reading the science fiction, you know, and then being shown little things. And then Chris Carter says, once you're in the program, you're always in the program, all these things just trying to line up in my head. I'm thinking, wow, this is real.
34:58 Yeah. Yeah. This is, there's a real thing to it, you know? And I started thinking, well, you know, the aliens had been here and I think, well, they've been here all along. I started to think like that. It was like, of course they'd been here all along, the fallen angels. I mean, it was just right on the backside of my memory, which I didn't quite fully recall, but it's like, I started to think like, yeah, no, aliens have been here for a long time. They're not just coming now. They've been here from the beginning. And not only that, the government is actually saying, coming out on podcasts and saying. These things come from outer space. So we're not willing to say they're ET. We see them already here. Something that's big lights in the sky that seem to cause, cause they track these things. They want to make sure that the ICBMs, intercontinental ballistic missiles, they see these bright flashes of light come up and they want to make sure they know exactly where it's going. They see things and they say, what is this that is happening right now and where is it coming from? Well, it's not outer space.
35:48 No. It's around here. No. So I guess, I guess because I sort of had that knowledge in the back of my head, which I wasn't completely remembering or locking it in, but I had, you know, a sense of that. I was applying that to this and I was kind of making, so I was kind of dealing with the reality that was there, but it was kind of been fictionalized, fictionalized. So it has a veneer over of, of deception, but yet there's something real there. So I'm trying to get to the heart of it, right? This with this thing. So, so I, I created this whole world, like visually with this music video was the inspiration. And then I kind of did a digital, this is when digital publishing was taking on, you know, like a magazine. I don't know if it's a thing so much anymore. Now people don't read magazines. I guess you do kind of read magazines on iPads and stuff, but it, digital publishing became a thing. And my wife is a graphic designer and we got involved with a company called Aquafotis who I think it's been bought.
36:39 It's been acquired by some other company, Rakuten maybe or something. But Aquafotis was a French software company that was, you know, at the forefront of doing some, you know, digital magazine stuff. So basically you, you create. You create, you develop a container app and then you just load issues, you know, you load up on Amazon servers and then basically, you know, people download a free app and then they pay $1.99, 99 cents to download an issue like a magazine issue. So my idea was to basically do a visual album on this app and I would do, I'd feature all these different artists and their work to basically, you know, like, oh, so, and so this artist was going to be my, the guy I was working with already for a few years, he'll be my first, you know, person that I basically feature, you know, in my app that I created. So I created the app for not just iOS, but also for Google Play, but it never really ran well on Android devices. It was more for iOS, but it was called Numenon Collection. Okay. So the word Numenon is very interesting. I was trying to find the right title for it. So phenomenon, you know what the word phenomenon, it's an occurrence, a circumstance or fact that is perceptible by the senses.
37:43 It's an unusual, significant or unaccountable fact or occurrence of marvel. That's a phenomenon. But what I wanted to do was to talk about the part that you don't see, that part that you don't perceive. And the opposite of that is Numenon, phenomenon, Numenon, Numenon is in philosophy, is a knowledge posited as an object. So it's the knowledge of something that's seen as an object because it exists outside of externally from your understanding. It exists independently of human sense. So it's the knowledge of something that goes beyond the senses. You know it's there, but how do you know it? Because we experience everything through our five senses. That's phenomenon. So we would see phenomena. Yeah. It's something that you don't see, how to know it. Numenon. Numenon. Numenon. So that was the name of the app, which you cannot find anywhere, it's gone. But that was the idea.
38:33 So that's the kind of, and I didn't realize what I was doing was basically esoteric thinking. That's really what it was. If I'd been told that, I would have run the other way. What am I getting involved in? But that's really what I was doing. I had no idea. So I guess the warning is false. The thing is, is that when you leave Bible truth, and you try to go off into the ether and sort of imagine, try to find reality through your own journey sometimes, unless you're actually biblically grounded, you will absolutely end up on the enemy's side. Absolutely. 100%. No matter how innocent you might be, no matter how sort of well-meaning you might be in this, if you leave the truth, you ignore the truth, and you go down another way to find a third way or a second way or whatever you want to say, it will always lead you to the enemy.
39:26 And that's what I realized in the end, as I was doing this stuff, that the Lord kept asking me this question. Because I never left God. I mean, I left the church at 16, and the first thing I gave up was the Sabbath. Because in order to keep the Sabbath, I couldn't do what I wanted to, like in radio at first, and then in Hollywood later. There's no way that you can work in that industry and say, well, I can't do anything from Sunday, from Sunday on Friday to Sunday on Sabbath. So that was the first thing I had to compromise on. But I never really, I never fully like, oh, God, I never was angry at God and never threw God out. I just kind of just compromised and kind of, well, you know, you kind of really want to do this, and this is so interesting, and I love it so much, and I just want to bring, you know, the light and the truth to that world, too. I want to go in that world and work in that world, and I thought I'd be an influence in that world for good. And instead, that world just turned me around.
40:20 Yeah. You know, away from my faith and ended up falling completely away from everything. So when I was on that journey, I was never completely divorced from God in my head. I was always like, you know, I would still pray to him. I would still, you know, say, I would still like, I know, you know, I believe in my guardian angel. And I know that God kept me through a lot of stuff, but I, he really did sort of, you know, he didn't hold me back and say, no, you can't go anywhere. He sort of like, you know, he let me, he let me fumble around a little bit and make my mistakes, but he never left me or forsook me. Okay. So the way that, uh, way the photography works and image taking, like for example, um, and we're in the studio, the reason why we see anything in here, we can make anything out is because of the light, right? Photons. So we don't actually see, you know, that telephone booth back there without light hitting it.
41:18 So what we're seeing is we're seeing light reflected and refracted off of that object. We don't, the object itself does not produce light. Light is hitting it and reflecting off of it. Right? So what I wanted to do in this project in kind of finding out what was going on, the Numenon to find, to try to find the world that was unseen was to actually start to photograph the light directly, the light source, not what something, you know, to go to the source of the light, not the reflection of the objects to go to the, so I would start, I started working with lasers. I invested in laser projectors and professional laser control, like Pangolin software, laser designer software, and start experimenting with that and working in completely dark black spaces with cameras. Yeah. Shooting lasers. Huh. Light. Have you seen those YouTube videos? Are they able to photograph a photon now? Yeah. Where they're slow it down. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I wasn't necessarily trying to do that per se, but I was, I was literally, I was, I was photographing beams. I mean, maybe if I would've kept going that way, but I really was trying to conceptually create something.
42:19 What I wanted to do was I wanted to visually represent the explanation of what happened to me. Mm-hmm. Whatever it was that flew over me. Whatever it was I lost the missing time from, or had the missing time from. Whatever it was that goes back to our creation, our story, where we're from. I wanted to peer behind the curtain. I was looking for the Numenon. Sure. The thing that you cannot perceive, but somehow represent it in art. Yeah. And so I was just playing with light and photographing it. There was one time when I was, I had my office where I was set up in the bay, in the bottom level of our house and I painted all my walls really dark brown with a semi-gloss, you know, so it's a little shiny, but like a cave almost, like I kind of had like a cave and I had my computer set up and everything, my speakers and it was, it was a really nice set up. And I would sit there at night and really work, you know, on this project and I had the laser projector behind me and I had it connected to another computer with the controller software. And I would, I would turn off the lights and I would flip on this, I'd flip on the laser projector and it would start up, it was a higher powered one.
43:21 Sure. And it would, the fans would kick on and everything. And it was the strange thing. Whenever that thing was running behind me. I felt like something was right behind me. I felt so strange with it turned on behind me because I literally felt like a presence, like it was really creepy. It was really, really creepy. I felt like it was so strange because I let myself kind of go down this very, you know, it was very slow to try to get, you know, getting involved with thinking like that and then, and then pursuing this art project. Like, so, I mean, the work that I created for that first issue that went into that digital magazine app was really, it was supposed to explore. Explain who it was and where it was these, these things come from and their story in a sense, like, like in a sense, it's like a manual for life from them about, but it, but it was all visual. It was all, um, symbols.
44:13 It was not, there's no, there's nothing human in it. Yeah. It couldn't have anything human in it. I actually, I was working with an illustrator that helped design a lot because we did basically design the language, you know, like a, like an alien language or something out of symbols and stuff. And we just wanted to make it so otherworldly. Yeah. And so out of like, out of, out of, you know, out of, out of our knowledge, but, but yet it was something we could see. So it was, yeah, it was very weird. So there was one night that I was listening to one of the tracks from the artist cause I was, I was doing a lot of it with the music that he was sending me for the album. And there was one night I would sit up on my balcony. I had a, I had a, I had a house in a glass hole park over looking, you know, to, to the West. So, you know, there's Hollywood, I could weigh down there's there's Santa Monica, there's the Pacific ocean, it's a great house. And I was, I was up there one night and it was the summer solstice.
45:06 It was a summer solstice. And I was, I was listening to a track over and over again. I was trying to figure out some visual ideas to something. And I was listening and I was listening and I started to think, and I thought, you know what? You're crazy. You're absolutely nuts. You're nuts. Spending all this time. You're focused on this stuff. This is not, this is like, you're just imagining this, this is, this is crazy. You're, you're going to lose your, you're losing your sanity. You, you started off like as just as experimenting visually and as an artist or whatever. And you've actually started to believe what you're doing, even though it was fiction. And I was like, this is crazy. I was like, wait a second. Wait a second. This is crazy. And just after I had that thought, uh, the music had stopped and I could just hear everything around me. And all I heard was helicopters, helicopters.
45:54 If you've ever been in Los Angeles, they call them the yard birds, these, these helicopters that fly with, and some, depending on the areas you live, those things are shining lights in people's backyards for like, you know, people running around, you know, looking at bangers doing stuff, you know? Yeah. And there was probably like an, as something, I remember looking at it over the LA skyline at night and just seeing like, you know, multiple helicopters, cause it's very flat there and just a sprawling city. If you've ever flown into Los Angeles, it just goes on forever. Right? So I'm looking out there at night and I had that view to see it like that. And there's all these little helicopters and there's no, it's all the helicopters and stuff. And I looked over and then there was one that was closer to me. And as I looked at it. I kind of felt like it's shined its light towards me, but I didn't really get illuminated. I just felt like, and then I started looking and it's like, it's looking at me. Why is that helicopter looking at me? Maybe a little paranoid. I don't know. But I was like, why is that helicopter looking at me? And I just kind of gave it a dirty look like, you know, I'm in my backyard. I've flown in helicopters shooting, right? I've, I've shot like, you know, productions I've, I've been one of the camera guys in a helicopter shooting in LA.
46:53 So I know what you can see from a helicopter. You see right down into people's yards and things like that. It's very easy to see. Right. So I was like, this guy's like looking at me, what's, why is he looking at me? And as I was looking at it, I saw, I felt very, suddenly I felt this feeling of shame. It was really strange, like emotional turn. And then I looked at it and then I saw it kind of like, it turned away from me like this. And as it turned away from me like this, it started to fly away and I started to watch it and I realized it didn't make any noise that had no sound, but I couldn't make out of shape. Cause I just saw like some light. It looked like, you know, just like, you know, you just, an indistinct thing with like a light on it or something. I didn't know what it was. And as it flew, it kind of flew up higher and higher and higher and higher. And it kind of went out over the city, but it didn't stay at the level of the other helicopters are still in one up to another level. And as it got higher and higher, it ramped up into speed and just went, it shot like that.
47:47 And then a split second later, 90 degrees to that. It went like that. It went like that and it just went off into the night sky high above me. Yeah. That's the worst story I have heard of that happening. And I think that it's really interesting cause we just had all that, that, that drone that happened over the, what was it, um, uh, New Jersey, right. And all over the world actually. And they were saying on the news, they're saying they had two people on the news and they were not, you know, just regular folk from the, the, the, the city. They were news anchors. And he says, no, what we're seeing, he says, I'm seeing helicopters, I'm seeing drones, but I'm seeing balls of light. I'm seeing other things. And I thought, well, that's interesting. You put these two things together and someone was saying that these things are changing into morphing, morphing into something else. I didn't, I have to say, I didn't believe him. But now that you told me that story, that, that, yeah, that's really interesting.
48:41 I can't say that. I mean, it didn't look like anything really, it didn't stand out from all the other helicopters. It didn't at all. It kind of looked like it was another helicopter. It was not like right above me or anything. It was kind of out in the distance, but for some reason I noticed it and the music stopped right. And it was like, oh, I'm seeing the thinking you're crazy. This is not real. And that's when I saw it. And it was almost like saying, no, I'm not crazy. I am. This is real. That's what I took away. And I went back inside and I lay on the floor for about an hour. I sat with my back up against the wall on the floor in the bathroom and I just sat there for like stunned into silence for like an hour. I was in shock. And actually after that point in my life, I went through a few years where I was just totally like I was in another place. Like it just. It stunned me. It shocked me.
49:29 It was like it was a. It was an experience that. Because I mean, it wasn't just remembering something that happened to me as a child. It was something all that situate all that thing. Chris Carter, once you're in the program, you know, it's like an X-Files line or something from like Deep Throat. Once you're in the program, you're always in the program, kid. And I was like, what happened? What did I just see? And I knew that was for me because the timing of it and I felt that there was some sort of inner connection because it was almost like it got my attention, like it was looking at me. It was just a feel. It was. I was stunned. Yeah. Yeah. And and that actually is what said, no. This is not this is not. This is real. It's not amazing. Oh, wow. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. So I went to go to continue to do that project and I went on and I shot all the stuff for it.
50:16 And so that that that app, when you went through the magazine, you'd sit there and scroll through the pages, these endless scrolling of like black background, like space with all these lasers, you know, light objects. It's hard to describe what I did. It's very and none of that stuff. It doesn't exist. You can't find it anymore. I took all that stuff down. But as I was doing it again, that voice would kept coming back to me saying, what are you doing this for? Who are you serving? Like, who are you glorifying with this work? And I'm like, I'm just making an art project was what I would say was like, I'm just it's just a system. It's just, you know, but I felt like over time that started to be sound like a cop out to me. So the music video that I designed for this. For this release, this digital publishing release for the Numenon app was was this woman in a dress.
51:05 I had this idea to photograph this model in this dress that I designed, which was on the front. It was it appeared as like a like a military style with epaulets and kind of the the buttons on it that looked like a military outfit. But it had a priest collar. So you had like a Roman Catholic priest collar with the military look. And it's a woman. And she's got the saturn. You know that the hat. The saturn. This is I forgot what it's called now, but it's it's it's the hat that represents like saturn. Okay. Like Italian monks or Italian priests. We wear this hat. I got that from like a Depeche Mode music video that I used to like and the back of the dress like like when she turns around, the back of the dress was an open back gown going all the way down to like below her tailbone. So on the front it was like one image and then when she turned around the back, it was like this seduction image.
51:53 It was, you know, so it was like military, fascist, religious, Catholic. Yeah. You know, like open gown dress. It was really like something maybe Fellini would have done if he was on crack. But yeah, I I designed that dress. I had someone make it a bespoke dress and I had fitted it for the person that was in it. So I did this video with it and I would sometimes I'd have this dress hanging up in my in my office and it was hanging above me. It used to be the person on the house before me had like a one of those, you know, we call was the punching bag. Right. So it's a big hook. So I hang that on that and that hook and I was in the head in one side that was all mirrors because it was like a it was like a little gym downstairs. So it's like a huge wall of mirrors. This dress is hanging and hooking. My desk was there and I'd look at it. I'd look at me looking at the dress and this dress was like above me like this.
52:43 And it was like it was so creepy. And again, that thought was like, what are you doing this for? Who are you serving? What do you what are you promoting with your work? The question kept coming back, you know, just gentle question. Who are you serving? And so the artist that I was doing the work with in in Germany came to Los Angeles and hung out with me with some of his friends and they stayed in my house. We stayed out, you know, like till four in the morning, sitting in the back, you know, partying a little and just, you know, playing music, you know, like unpublished stuff that he was working on and we talking about, you know, the stuff we're doing and and he would just ask me questions. You ever heard of Adam West? Hi, mom. At this time, I had no idea who he was, you know, the founder of the German Bavarian Illuminati. Yeah. And I was like, Hmm, because years later, when I came, when I was watching Walter Veith, Total Onslaught, and I was like, seeing all the connections from the occult world to Hollywood, to the entertainment business, to the governments of the world and, you know, the Confederacy of men that are working together to bring about, you know, the end times that was going on.
53:46 And I realized, wow, that's the stuff that I was kind of involved with. I had no idea. Like the name started to come on. Yeah, that's the name that that artist mentioned. He was asking me if I'd ever heard. So I realized. I said some things to them, and they said some things back, and I realize now when I recall the conversations, it's like they were totally involved in that world. And now it makes sense because a lot of people that are involved in the music business, not everybody, but a lot of people that are into it, it's like a religion to them. And they're like high priests of that religion, you know, getting entire crowds and stadiums and raves to basically become like, you know, entranced with a spirit or to kind of control them. And they all jump up at the same time. And they all do sorts of, you know, it's a shamanistic experience. Music can be very much like that. And in that world, it's, you know, that's the religion for many of them. Not everybody, but for a lot of them. And so I realized later from the guy's solo album, from the things that he said to me, that this guy was like a Luciferian.
54:44 I had, you know, nice guy, quiet, you know, gentle, well, you know, well spoken, interesting, creative, you know, engaging. And I'm thinking, you know, this is, you know. I don't know. I'm a normal guy. So at one point, the artist also sends me all his lyrics like he shows up in L.A. to stay with me. I told you he stays with me for like a weekend and he gives me all like his original lyric sheets that he wrote all the lyrics out to all the songs like he actually had a second another person write all lyrics. He's German. He doesn't speak English natively. So he has an English speaker write his lyrics for him, but he works with him on the lyrics, you know, the theme and everything. But he has somebody else like a poet, like writing lyrics for his songs. And so he hands me his like his, you know. You know, portfolio of all the you know, so it's like, you know, scratch paper and it's like the lyrics are all scratched. That's like, you know, that's like that's kind of cool because it was like to either go with artwork or was a souvenir to me or whatever.
55:38 And I was just going through like, oh, yeah, that song, that song. And then there was this one sheet on there and I don't remember the name of the song, but I was reading. I was like, no, this he never gave me this song. And as I read the song, as I read the lyrics, it was describing it was like a voice speaking of from from the Numenon. You could say. Yeah. From the unknown speaking to I'm just, you know, I'm just beyond what you see. I'm just not, you know, there, you know, you can't see me or what, but I'm there watching you. And it was like it was kind of the song it was written. It was creeped me out because it was it was talking to me as if as if I was knowing what it would say, but nobody else and it was not even on the album. But why did he give me that sheet of music? We never had that conversation about it. You know, we didn't have the artist. I didn't have a conversation on that level of, you know, I was not telling the artist exactly what I was doing. I was showing him the artwork and I and it was kind of going with it. He says he'd get the goosebumps when I would send him some of the stuff I was doing.
56:32 He'd get the goosebumps like, oh, this is great. This is perfect for what I'm doing. You know, there was a it was a good collaboration. And so when I got this, this this music or that there's these lyrics for a song that he didn't record that I'm not aware of. It was it was really it was again, this it was another way of the other side is reaching out to me and saying, yeah, I know you, I'm you know, I'm talking to you. Don't worry. I know what's going on. And it was it was kind of creepy. And I asked him about it later. He says, I don't know what you're talking about. I just I don't know what that is. I don't know what I just you know, I just gave you my head. You know, I didn't really I don't know how that would have been in there if it's a song that I didn't, you know, didn't do. So it was like, OK, so, yeah, little weird things like that would happen and it would just keep just adding at the same time, it was kind of drawing me further down, like I've really caught something I'm really on to something at the same time, it would also again, you know, like. My Spidey, you know, the back of the hair, the back of the neck, the hair stands up and you go, who it is that I'm actually serving here?
57:32 Who am I working for? What am I doing? I remember when I was a kid that, you know, in the 80s, there was a lot of ministries that were talking about backwards masking music. I remember listening to those stories and testimonies of people working in, you know, albums where like the drums played themselves or like a song sheet was blank in the, you know, the night before when they woke up in the morning, all the lyrics had been written out for them to sing. And. Things like that. The story of Hotel California. All that. I mean, yes, it's talking about the business. It's talking about California and Hollywood and all that, but there is a spiritual element to it that we know as Christians, that's a reality. The other sides take on things and their, their experience and, and so I, I realize now looking back at the artists I was involved with was totally into the occult, a hundred percent involved in the occult. And I would, I would sometimes keep in touch with him on Skype and stuff and saying what's going on. And he would tell me what's going on with him and, and he would share pictures of stuff that he was doing. And. He would send me some strange pictures. I don't know. I can't even, you know, he would send me some strange, you know, like supernatural photographs of like things happening like that, you know, they're not Photoshop, but they're like, you know, photographs of, of, you know, people levitating and you just all kinds of things like that.
58:39 I didn't think too much of it, but he was, you know, just sharing that stuff with me and kind of, you know, collaborating. And I, I just realized I was really involved with someone that was in the occult, like super into the occult. And I didn't, you know, like I said, it was all sort of, you know. Yeah. I wouldn't say it's innocent. I'm not making excuses for myself, but it's like, I didn't go searching for it. Sure. I just wandered away. I was the sheep that wandered away from the fold. Yeah. You know, to go, to go check out the world as the prodigal son to go see the, what the world was like outside my father's house. Another thing that was happening too, when I was doing this, this project, I did a music video. I was doing like photo shoots with all these lasers and all this stuff to create all these, this imagery is that people would come and work with me that I just happened to find like. Like happenstance, like Providence seemed to provide people that were just there at the right time to do the job.
59:29 And when I would talk to them, they had very similar. They had like either a background where they like to go to graveyards and hang out at night and talk to, you know, like commune with the dead or they would, or they were just like technicians that were, you know, involved in, in what I was doing and very good at it. But they had a kind of a, a spiritualistic, when I've talked to them and we would just talk about the project, what we're doing, they would talk about those kinds of things. And I didn't think too much of the time. I just seemed to be meeting lots of people. Yeah. Lots of people that had that sort of interest or background at the same time. It's kind of like, you know, when you're in ministering, you do things for God, you know, God puts those kind of people in your path to meet like-minded people. Yeah. And, and, you know, and God wants to bring his saints together to work and collaborate. And of course in congregations, God brings them together in churches and the devil is no different in getting people that are interested in those things to meet other people that are also interested in those things. And so I realized that I was starting to work with some of those people that were from that background that I was not realizing what I was truly getting involved with.
1:00:24 Wow. In Hollywood. There's an element of that for sure there. Wow. Do you think these people have had the same experiences? They had different kinds of experiences. Their experiences were not so much, you know, like with unidentified, what they call UAPs now. It was not so much their experience. There was more like, you know, the, the, the paranormal stuff that kind of the more of the spiritualist stuff that directly spiritualist. Now, I mean, the UAP thing is spiritualism a hundred percent and I didn't really fully realize it until I kind of came back to church and I sort of, you know, realizing what I had been in. I realized I started seeing stories online, people's testimonies about, you know, summoning UFOs with magic ceremonies and, or rituals or, or chanting now, you know, then this whole thing had happened in New Jersey. People were out there with videos saying, well, you just have to try to communicate with them. Just send your thoughts to it and you watch it'll actually, but see, I had that experience on that balcony in my home that night when I saw that helicopter turn into something that just flew up into the sky. It's like, it was a thought thing and it was like, this is really demonic.
1:01:19 Yeah. So I started, it started to dawn on me after I got out. Yeah. I started to get a sense out of it that how, you know, how spiritual, spiritualistic it really is. It's, it's nothing but spiritualism. It's not UFOs. It's not aliens in that sense. I was so fascinated with what was the big picture of reality. I knew that there was one answer, not like multiverse where like everyone has their own reality and we're all living in some multiverse where everyone's reality is the reality. It's like, no, no, no, there is one reality. And that's what I was obsessed with trying to figure out. That was the new man on thing. Like, what's that object that I don't know that like a thought object. What is that thing that I don't understand that's out there that I know it's like the big picture. The Bible is there with the answers. So the Bible has the answers. The other side is going to provide something that seems like it's the answer. It's going to, it's going to dazzle you. It's going to wow you.
1:02:08 It's going to do things that, you know, are miraculous. And you're going to go like, well, that's truly reality. That's truly God. That's truly power because the manifestations, what it can do, it can break the laws of physics. You look to that, that seems to be the answer. That's a higher power. That's a, you know, what is the purpose of that? That thing. It must be, it must be a higher than, than me, obviously. So I, you know, there's a natural tendency to like, well, you know, what do you want me to, you know, it's like you look to it and you're just looking for answers. It's like you, it's going to provide answers for you that are going to be contradicting the Bible and that that's the whole purpose. So my, my fascination was, was to understand what was the big picture of life. And when I came back to the church and I started to read the Bible, I started to read. You know, the spirit of prophecy, I started the, I, some reason I saw it, like I never saw it when I was a kid, I was really truly convicted by it and believed it in a way that I couldn't have when I was like, you know, 12 or 10 years old.
1:03:05 I just, I was ready at this point in my life to see it and to really believe it and understand it because I'd gone searching out in the world. I'd seen what the world had, but I had enough knowledge from the Bible to know that what I was seeing made me question it and the question, who is that you're serving? So when I came back and. It turns out all the questions that I had about the nature of existence of where we come from and the nature of good and evil. What does it mean? The tree of life? What is it all about? The Bible answers that. And so go, like you mentioned the angels that fell from heaven. We were created to repopulate heaven. We were created to be one with the heavenly hosts in heaven. I mean, this is like, I mean, you know, people talk about like, what's the meaning of life? You know, why am I here on this earth? It's like you're, you're create, you were created on this earth to, to see that through test and trial. If you would be loyal. You would be one with the heavenly host.
1:03:55 I mean, can you imagine that we would be brothers and your fellow servants? What does John say in the book of revelation? When he's down, he's overwhelmed with a vision. He starts to worship at the feet of the angel and says, no, get up. Don't worship God alone. I'm just your fellow servant. I'm your fellow servant. Every one of us has a guardian angel. You have a guardian angel. I have a guardian angel. They know each other. They're friends. The same thing as with the demons too. Yeah. And you make a decision who it is you're going to follow, who it is that you're going to serve. They're behind the good and the bad, and they're not allowed to directly get involved necessarily. I mean, sometimes the guardian angel will save you and I've been saved a number of times, you know, physically from death, but you know, God allows us to go through this experience to see where our hearts are, to see who it is we truly love and serve.
1:04:44 And so when I found the truth, it convicted me and it broke my heart and it caused me to have that love and gratitude towards my creator. That. It was a yearning for it to connect to the truth. And when I found that truth and I saw that it was solid and it was real and it was under my feet, that's when everything started to fall away. All these other illusions, all these things that I'd been involved with that it was like suddenly I was like, this is what I was actually looking for. This is the actual answer. And then I discovered the sanctuary righteousness by faith. I'm like, wow, this is the great answer of the explanation of what the tree of knowledge and good and evil is all about. And this is what the sanctuary being cleansed is all about. This is what God has done with his son, Jesus Christ. Yeah. Jesus Christ for all of us, that we can all be our slates wiped clean, not just forgiven, but our sins blotted out as if we'd never sinned.
1:05:32 Because that has to happen for us to be in heaven. Sin has to be completely eradicated also in us. Yeah. And that's really what the battle is over. And I just, these things started to all kind of fall into place and make sense. And that's why the ministry I do focuses on the heavenly sanctuary and righteousness by faith. Because it's actually. Yeah. The question that he put in my heart long ago is like, I believe God was asking me that question. You know, what is the nature, you know, what is the nature of the tree of life? What is the nature of the tree of knowledge and good and evil? What is that really about? He planted a question and I looked and I sought for it with all my heart. And though I went in the wrong direction, because where I was, he eventually led me back to the truth. And when I'd seen the whole thing, I was able to say, I know that my Lord is true. Wow. Wow. And so today you, how long has it been since you've been in Hollywood? I was, I, I mean, I started in, in Australia, I started working in Australia in, in 94.
1:06:29 And I got out of the business. I officially resigned my union membership in December 31st, 2019, and became a Bible worker January 1st, 2020. Wow. Wow. So it was about 25 years in Hollywood. Praise God. Praise God. And where are you based now? I'm based out of Brisbane. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm in British Columbia right now, and I've, you know, I've been working there as a Bible worker for five years now. I'm fully independent. I'm working just under, under the ministry, Sanctuary Door Ministry. It's the sanctuarydoorministry.com. That's a place where you can find me. You can find, you know, messages I've done. You can find PDFs of Bible studies I've done, because as a Bible worker, I developed a set of Bible series, Bible studies that basically prepare you for baptism. It's not all of them, but it's, it's the evangelistic part of the Bible study series.
1:07:19 And I've done that also in person. I do, I travel around and I do evangelism in churches, you know, old school evangelism. But it's a, it's a, it's a line upon line study where it's not just like a verse with some pretty pictures and then a bunch of me talking. It's actually a Bible study. You go from verse to verse to verse to verse, all stacked up, just black and white Helvetica with emphasis, showing you the links, because I want it to all be about what the verse says. And you just read the words here. You read the words here. You read the words here. You see like three different verses on the screen. And I can show you, I have a presentation like that called Our High Calling, which talks about the angels that fell from heaven. And it shows you the, you know, the Bible study. You know, that God has redeemed a third of the, of the humanity. It's like he's replacing the angels that fell with us. I mean, so using the Bible to show that, not just, you know, some theoretical, oh, this is my theory about what's happening. It's like, no, here's the Bible study. Here's verse, verse, verse. And that's how I do Bible studies, because everything I say and want and stand on is found in the word of God. That's what my whole thing is. And so I know I've been able to reach people as a Bible worker and going other places to reach people in the world that don't have a Christian background even, or have a different Christian background, different faith tradition.
1:08:21 But they're, but they, but they follow it because that's what the Bible says. It's like, not me. It's not what our church says. It's not a pamphlet that was, that's handed to them. It's like, no, it's just take your Bible out. Look here, look here, look here. Notice how it's, what it says and look how it connects. It's allowing the word of God to speak directly to people. And that's, that's what my ministry is about. That's what God has called. And that's like, it's the greatest job I've had in my life. Better than anything. It satisfies all the curiosity and all the, the itching ear things you want to like, you know, what's going on in the, you know, what's really behind everything. What's the big picture. What's all that stuff that I was interested in as a kid. It answers all of the questions that satisfies everything in my heart that I want to know. It's like, God's given to me in his word, you know, and unless I had the grounding I had, you know, as a child, unless I did it, I don't know. I know God can reach anyone.
1:09:09 I mean, but I, I don't, I'm so thankful that I had the education that I did, even if I didn't, wasn't fully converted by it or, or completely internalized that I had just a knowledge of it. I'm glad I had that because if I didn't have that. I mean, it was literally idea of what's happening in Daniel and revelation is real. Now, you know, it's like, I see it happening in the world. What's taking place. It's like, yeah, yeah, no, I'm glad I have that as a reference to know where to come to, to the, where the truth is, because many people don't have that. And that's the reason why we have to be on that message on prophecy, prophecy being fulfilled, because we've been given that to show the world that the Bible is true, that the Bible talks about the future that is still yet to come. And it's going to be the things that have happened in the past are repeating, right? Ecclesiastes. He's done that. He's done that. Ecclesiastes 9 is that there's no new thing under the sun. So we need to study our Bibles. We need to find out what happened in the past, that it's repeating with Babylon and the future and revelation, this whole world that gets caught up in the system that we're supposed to call people out of.
1:10:02 We have to go back and see what Babylon did in the past. And we have to show people what Babylon did in the past, because it says they're going to cause the entire world to follow this system. This woman, this church is going to lead the entire world, you know, to perdition, to hell, to receive of the plagues and to receive the mark of the beast. And it's, you know, it's. It's not some, it's not some unknown thing. It's like we have this knowledge and we have this information and it's like, it's become sort of like a, an optional thing that, oh, that's not really that important or no, it's actually that knowledge is actually, I believe that's what God used to bring me home. Absolutely. Good place to end. Would you say a quick prayer for us? Yeah. Father in heaven, I just thank you, Lord, that you have called me out of the world and you've called me to something.
1:10:54 Much better to do. And it's thank you every single day that I wake up, that I have this new life and I'm just grateful for it. And just pray that you've used whatever has been said, whatever has been in this testimony that would be to your honor, to glory, but you would use. And I thank you, Lord, for hearing. I thank you for answering. I pray for my brothers and sisters that are out there. Those are experiencing things with, with the paranormal or with UFOs or any of those things or questions about life with that. You would be the one that steps forward, puts an answer before them that they may follow. Because I know that if they, they begin to listen to you, they will find you and come to you. In Jesus' name.